(Please see my previous blogs so the story makes sense!)
This post is going to be a long one. I want to illustrate what it’s like to argue with a narcissist. They have a special way of arguing. One that almost makes no sense and it’s important to understand the tactics they use so that you know not to get sucked into their traps.
The baby had been born and my mom finally got to meet her. She was happy yet sad at the same time. She knew how hurtful it was for me not to get to meet my new niece. My whole family was trying to remain positive that this baby would somehow magically fix things and would evoke some human emotion into Satan, but it didn’t happen. My mom is a fixer by nature. I take after her to some degree. I can’t fault her for it. I think after the baby was born and a few months went by, my mom realized she wasn’t going to be able to fix it. I think she finally realized she had to accept things the way they were and move on but in order to do so, she needed closure.
My mom and I had gotten into it one day. I admit it was my own fault. I didn’t want to hear about my brother’s kid. My mom saw the baby one or two times in the first few months of her life. She called me up after her second visit with the baby and caught me at a bad time. She started going on and on, gushing about the baby and how cute it was. I felt bad but I kind of had to tell her to stop. She didn’t understand, it was very upsetting for me. That was my brother’s first kid. It was my first real niece. I have two other nieces from my half sisters but this was my own brother who shared both the same parents as me. I never lived with my sisters and they are much older than me. It hurt me to know that I was never going to see or hold her as a baby. I would never have a bond with her. I was pretty hurt by the lack of response to the gift I got the baby. Hearing about the baby also reminded me how my brother hadn’t seen my son, except for at that one family party, in over a year. In retrospect, I should’ve sucked it up and listened to her. It was unfair of me to get angry at her. She did nothing wrong.
We didn’t speak for a day (which was very unusual for us given the fact we’d speak at least once a day) and when that happened one of us would usually give in and call the other. This time it was her. I answered the phone and she tells me, “you’re never going to believe what just happened…..”. I asked her what had happened and she responds by telling me she is so pissed off. She goes on to tell me that she just cannot take having the division in our family anymore and so she decided to take action. For the past year and a half she and my brother got into many verbal battles about it, we both did, but she had finally realized that my brother no longer had control over his own life. Even if there was a willingness on his end, it wasn’t going to happen. We both know my brother and what type of person he is, and the person he had been for the last year and a half is NOT him! My brother isn’t a grudge holder. He knows how to resolve issues. In my household growing up when someone had issues we sat down and discussed them, that’s how we moved past things. Every time we tried to discuss this with my brother, he would get very defensive, right off the bat. We were raised to love family unconditionally and to forgive. I have to add here also that my brother didn’t seem to understand that it was HIS job to bridge the gap between us and his wife. Whenever we’d try to fix things he’d point us to his wife and say if we had a problem with her to deal with her directly. He didn’t get that we didn’t invite this person onto our lives. He brought her in. It’s his job to make the connection between her and his family. It’s his job to bring her around and allow time for bonds to be built. He knew how to do it with past girlfriends, so why all of the sudden did he have amnesia?
With that said, my mom knew talking to him was futile. It was a complete waste of time and so this time she went straight to the source, Satan herself. I have to say I was shocked. That took some balls. After hearing that first fight that my mom had recorded, plus the argument I had with her on my porch, I knew that me talking to her directly was not a good idea. I have no patience for someone like her who talks over you and doesn’t listen to a word you say. Speaking of recordings, my mom recorded this phone call as well. ( I have to note here that I don’t think my mom was recording her with any malicious intent. I think my mom was hoping maybe her family was right, and that after the baby was born, she would be more open to fixing things. One would think you’d have to be a pretty cruel person to keep your husband from sharing his first and only child with his family).
My mom wasted no time and she played the recording for me. It starts off nicely. Satan answers and she is saying goodbye to my brother who is supposedly going off to the gym. She gets back on and apologizes to my mom and so my mom again wasted no time. There was no chit chat, no small talk, she cut to the chase. Her voice shaking a bit she tells Satan that she’s been trying to talk to my brother for a while now about this and it just seems like she isn’t getting anywhere. The reason it’s not getting anywhere is because she doesn’t think HE is the one who she needs to be talking to. Satan lets out a very hesitant, ok and my mom comes right out with it, “do you ever think there’s going to be a day that you can find it in your heart to let my son, heal his relationship with his sister….that all of you can heal your relationships?”. Satan gets defensive and starts stumbling and stuttering, “I’m, I’m not, NOT letting him do anything.”. My mom says in a nervous way, “well I’m not saying you’re not letting him, but do you ever think you’ll encourage it?” Satan now starts getting angry and says, “I’m not encouraging it, I’m not discouraging it, honestly it’s not a topic of conversation that I’m having with him.”. My mom responds, “well that’s what I’m wondering, maybe it could be a topic of conversation one day?”. Satan replies with, “listen he’s a 36 or 30 whatever year old man, if he wants to fix things he’d have to do it himself, you know what I mean?” My mom says, “even though you say you don’t discourage it, I think you kind of do in a way.” She laughed nervously at the end there, and Satan asks my mom how she’s discouraging it. My mom went on to give her an example of how she is in fact discouraging it and she does so by stating the fact that I brought her a gift for the baby shower. Satan plays dumb and says, “okay???”, and my mom goes on to say, “if you were in anyway encouraging it, you would’ve thanked her or [my brother] would’ve thanked her.”. Satan comes back, ” I did, I said if you can send her a thank you…..he didn’t, not my choice!”.
My brother told my mom that some of the thank you’s got lost in the mail, now the truth comes out! They both vehemently deny that Satan has any control over him. She pretty much showed all her cards by saying that she told him he can send a thank you. First off that shows how controlling she is. Why does he need her permission to thank me? Second, I think any normal person regardless of how they felt, would’ve sent a thank you or like I did, thanked them and gave them the gift back if they didn’t feel comfortable accepting it.
Now what happens next is something that Satan does often. She is being backed into a corner. My mom is playing it cool and saying, “oh ok, so he had a choice and he didn’t take it?”. Satan didn’t know how to reply to that and so she starts to stutter and stumble. She can’t organize her thoughts and so what does she do? She blame-shifts and diverts the convo away from her and says, “now go on the other foot, the reason why your son didn’t go to your party is because I wasn’t invited”. What does my mom’s party have to do with anything? Why bring it up? My mom wasn’t talking about her party that took place almost 7 months prior to this conversation. She was asking why I wasn’t thanked for the gift I sent. This is what these people do when they argue. They try to confuse you and so they repeatedly change the subject. This is where my mom failed a bit. She remained calm but at times, she fell for it. When Satan tried doing that to me, I kept her focused. I wouldn’t allow her to change the subject and that’s why she ended up getting up and walking away.
My mom responds and tells her there were so many things I wasn’t invited to but Satan is over-talking her saying, “don’t put it all on me! Don’t put it all on me!”. Narcissists will do ANYTHING to escape taking responsibility for their misdeeds. When that didn’t work she starts giving my mom an excuse for why she didn’t come to her party. They were going to get pregnant that day and it was the only day they could do it. Satan than Stupidly asks what I wasn’t invited to and my mom says, “Well she wasn’t invited to your wedding!”. Satan had an answer for that, “I had the invitation, I went to her house, she didn’t like what I said and so she slammed the door in my face! That’s HER choice! She made choices!” (Obviously not the real story there) My mom basically explains that she could’ve basically taken the high road and still invited me. Satan comes back with the most ridiculous shit ever, “not after what she wrote to your son and what she said she was going to do if I invited her!”. My mom says, “she didn’t say she wasn’t going to do anything and [my brother] knows she wouldn’t do anything.”. I can say with 10000000% certainty that I NEVER said I was going to do anything at their wedding nor anything close to it! That was a complete and utter bullshit lie. Normally I can see where she twisted her words from but that one got me. She completely made that one up. She offers to read it to my mom and once my mom accepts the offer, what does she do? Of course, she changes the subject! She knew she had nothing to read to my mom. She goes on and says, “I’m not going to fight about this with you…”. Narcissistic Translation, “unless I’m right, and you accept I’m right, I don’t want to discuss this!”
Then she goes on, “you don’t want to read the letter? You think I’m the one sitting here going, don’t call your sister, don’t do this, don’t to that….”, my mom cuts her off and says, “to tell you the truth, [my brother] can’t even come to my house unattended.” Satan yells, “what do you mean unattended?!”. My mom clarifies, “alone.”. Satan knew the jig was up and again she starts to stutter, ” I, I, I, don’t know what he does….I, I, would have to ask him if he’s ever been to your house alone…I’m pretty sure he’s been to your house alone… I don’t know….” my mom tells her, “maybe once to pick up some mail.”. That was it. In the year and a half that he was with Satan he went to my mom’s house exactly one time alone to pick up mail and he was in and out.
My mom now took control of the convo and says, “in the long and short of it worse things happen to people.” Mind you Satan is trying to over talk her every time she says anything and so my mom says, “listen you made a mistake….” before she finishes Satan starts getting really angry and yells, “no, no, no, conversations over…RIGHT NOW!! I did not make any mistakes!”. My mom jumps in, “you all made mistakes.” Satan replies, “then the conversation is over, THAT’S IT!”. She then states that she didn’t make any mistakes and she asks my mom what mistake she made. My mom then explains that she made the mistake of coming into our family and insisted I change my dress for their wedding, but as usual, Satan denies it, “I NEVER, insisted on anything…. that’s what you seem to not get is that this goes backwards….if you actually speak to your son and ask your son; I told him NOT to say anything about the dress.” This was the first time we were hearing this defense that not only was it not her but she even tried to stop my brother from saying anything about my dress! Little did she know, my brother had already told me and my mom during his brief moment of clarity, a few months prior that it was all her fault! My mom reminded her that back when she had that fight with them, she was the one saying things like, “well you know what, it’s my wedding too, if I want to tell her to wear this….YOU SAID IT to me! You told me that she could have carte Blanche to change into a different dress one for the ceremony and one for the party….” Satan was talking the whole time but it’s hard to hear her. She comes in clearly saying, “and we’re never going to have this conversation again…you are saying things that are completely false!” They weren’t even slightly false. Those are her exact words, verbatim! She absolutely cannot deny it! They are her words and they are on tape. Again more lies. She then tries to gaslight my mom by telling her that she doesn’t want to listen and that she only wants to say what she wants to say, and then she’s back to blaming my brother and her telling him NOT to say anything to me! She just couldn’t accept the responsibility. She went back into her original story about how she wasn’t even here, she was in the city, at work…..blah, blah, blah. It’s my brothers problem and not hers. My mom then got her good, she asks her, “how come that day when I came to your house, why didn’t you just say, tell your sister to wear whatever she wants to wear?”. Once again Satan is confronted with a very valid point in which she cannot refute and so she changes the subject.
She tells her she gets it, I’m her daughter… my mom says, “it’s my daughter and my son! It’s my daughter and my son!” Hearing her say that to this day breaks my heart. I would think any normal person would’ve just gave in by now and said they’d try, but no, not Satan. She couldn’t. She had keep going and so started the smear campaign against me. She starts telling my mom that she’s blind to a lot of the things I do. What exactly those things are, I don’t know. The problem here is that she cannot understand the kind of relationship we had. She doesn’t have an open and honest relationship with anyone, let alone her mother. More narcissistic gaslighting but my mom wasn’t going to let her get away with it. She told Satan that she’s actually the blind one because she doesn’t even know me, that she had only met me a handful of times before everything happened. Again, Satan is backed into a corner and so she must change the subject by saying, “I don’t know her, that’s great….I don’t know what that even means.” My mom kept going, “you have a preconceived notion about her, you don’t even know who she is….” but Satan keeps talking and tells her, “don’t cause drama around me, that’s it. You want to cause drama go somewhere else…I’m not doing drama…I’m telling you right now, I’m not doing it!”. My mom remains calm and says, “ok don’t do drama. I thought I could talk to you but I kind knew this was the way it was going to turn out, and it is the way it turned out.”
Satan couldn’t find any good defenses this day. My mom totally caught her off guard. She comes back with yet another subject change, “I don’t even know what you’re talking about at this point…you’re calling me up out of nowhere….”. She goes on to explain to my mom that they the previous day when my mom hung out with them that they had no intentions of inviting her before my mom called my brother. She had to point out that us was HER idea to invite my mom along with them. In reality though my mom hadn’t heard from my brother in weeks. She called because she wanted to see how the baby was and they decided at the last minute to invite her to go to a fair with them. She says to my mom, “you’re saying I’m actually doing these things but I’m actually trying so you see your son and see your granddaughter.”. The reality is, she wasn’t trying anything. My mom acknowledged that she was trying but went on to say that she knows Satan is tying to blame it exclusively on my brother but she knows it’s not all my brother. She explained to her how my dad didn’t talk to his brother for over 30 years and that my mom never even met his brother but because of the sense of family she had, she always encouraged my dad to try to make amends with his brother. Satan can’t understand positive things like that and so she asks my mom if she encouraged my dad to do it everyday! I mean really? Then she explains, “it’s not my daily chore to do this!” My mom tells her, “I’m not saying it’s your daily chore but you could’ve taken a step forward and said it was nice of your sister to get something for the baby….” Satan cuts her off, “how do you know I didn’t?”. My mom replies, “well you didn’t do anything to thank her…”. Here’s where I really have to laugh, Satan comes back with, “it’s not MY sister, it’s HIS sister….and I can go get him right now, put him on the phone and he can tell you I said to him, you want to send a thank you, there they are.” My mom replies to her, “well that’s like saying if you want to do it, I’m not doing it!”. Satan says, “exactly, I wasn’t going to do it! If he wanted to do it he could’ve done it!”. My mom tries to appease her by saying “you’re right I’m not going to put it all on you, I just thought you would help in some way but…”. Satan is over talking her, “you don’t know what I’ve done.” but my mom kept going, “you can both remain thick about it.”
What doesn’t make sense here is that she’s telling my mom it’s not her problem, it’s not her choice, it’s not her, my brother had a choice but in the next breath she is telling my mom she, “assumes a lot of things. She doesn’t know what’s she’s done and hasn’t done.” (To help the situation, I assume). My mom tells her that maybe she is assuming, maybe it’s all my brother and if it is she’s so disappointed in him and of course, Satan has to push the blame on me and says, “well maybe you should be disappointed in your daughter as well.”. It’s all about blame for her. She tells my mom to “stop putting everything on me and [my brother] and put some of it on [me].” “My mom explains that she’s not disappointed in my because she knows how I feel. She knows what’s in my heart because I tell her how I feel. So Satan starts asking my mom why she doesn’t tell me to say hi to my brother at parties and such. My mom explains that I made several attempts to try and fix things but my brother always squashes them by either ignoring me or being nasty. Satan pretends that she doesn’t know about any attempts to reconcile and only knows about nasty letters I wrote to him and whatnot.
We never knew for sure if my brother showed her the letters I wrote him after my mom’s party. She apparently didn’t see them because there was a slight confusion. Satan is talking about letters I wrote but she was talking about ones I wrote when everything first happened. My mom was talking about the letters I had written more recently trying to fix things and Satan said she didn’t see them until way after. Again she starts with the, “what do you want me to do, harass my husband everyday and ask if he talked to his sister?”. My mom explains to her, “no” and Satan asks, “well what do you want me to do?”. My mom then goes on to say, “both of you are horrible to eachother, you’re both very selfish, you’re in your own little world, which is great but he doesn’t care that you’re not talking to your sister, you don’t care that he isn’t talking to his….there are people in your life that have cared about you your whole life and if you can close them out for the rest of your life, more power to you!”. At this point Satan gets really nasty and defensive. She tells my mom, “you don’t know why I don’t talk to my sister….”. She’s right we don’t know the real reason. Back when my mom had that first fight with them she told my mom it was because her sister’s husband “tried to kill her”. Then weeks later it changed to “he threatened to kill her.”. We knew it had something to do with the sister’s husband but we didn’t know exactly what. The guy ended up committing suicide and guess what? She STILL doesn’t talk to her sister! In this conversation though she told my mom, “it’s none of your business whether I do talk to my sister, whether I don’t talk to my sister, it’s none of your business!”. My mom says, “you’re right, it is none of my business, do what you want.”. Satan says, “you’re right, it’s none of your business, I don’t care if you like it, if you don’t like it, you don’t HAVE to like it, my family is none of your business!.” My mom was agreeing with her that it was not her business and that she didn’t need an explanation for why she didn’t talk to her sister but yet Satan kept arguing with her about it and asks her again as she laughed, “really, what do you expect me to do?” My mom tells her, “I have no expectations, really….I should’ve known that it was going to turn into an argument because I see [my daughter] is a very sore subject with you…” she goes on, “for someone that came into a family and makes all these demands about what people should wear after only meeting them 6 or 7 times, I would’ve told my husband, what are you doing? Tell your sister to wear whatever she wants”. Satan says, “how am I supposed to know what goes on in their family? I don’t know if they fight.”. I’m not even sure what she meant by that? What does it matter if we fight or not?” My mom told her it doesn’t matter, she would NEVER step foot into a family and act the way Satan acted. She would never make the demands she made. Satan is denying it again but my mom kept going and again reminded her that even though she is denying it, she still told my mom that I can have “carte Blanche” to the bridal suite and o can change into a different dress….” Satan again being backed into a corner and so she must deflect the convo away from her and she does so by telling my mom that I said, “this is what [Satan] gets for not putting me in her bridal party!”. That’s not what I said at all. What I said was, “if she wanted to control what I wore, she should’ve put me in her bridal party.” That’s what narcissists do. She turned my statement into a threat. Again she offers up her “proof” and asks my mom if she wants her to send the email. My mom takes her up on the offer and so while they’re on the phone she is acting like she’s looking for the email and sending it to my mom. My mom never received the email. My mom begs, “please, I need to see that because I never saw it.”. When she finally realizes that no such email exists she asks my mom if she ever saw the text messages she sent to me. She never sent me any text messages. I text her at one point and so she finds the messages in her phone and starts to read them off to my mom. They say, “hope your happy. You got my brother where you want him. Isolated and totally dependent on you.” She replies to me, “we are very happy together.” and I reply, “you’re so cute.” After she reads them my mom says, “ok what does that have to do with anything?”. She was trying to make it as if she had “reached out” to me at some point and I think in her head she believed her own lie. She NEVER reached out to me aside from showing up at my house unannounced. She went on to tell my mom, that she has reached out and when my mom said she doesn’t know of her ever reaching out, she tried to convince my mom it’s because I don’t tell her! Again, no concept of the type of relationship me and my mom had and how deeply we discuss things like this. My mom knew EVERYTHING! I told her exactly what happened every step of the way. My mom asks her if she wants her to go back and read texts that she sent to her that weren’t so nice and again when Satan is backed into a corner, she flips the blame onto my mom and says, “after the way you treat me, you expect me to be nice? I’m trying to make sure, so you actually have a relationship with your son and granddaughter but I’m telling you right now, you doing this, it’s not helping!”.
That’s the crazy part again, it’s not her, my brother makes his own choices but then she says that she’s trying to “make sure” my brother has a relationship with my mom. She contradicts herself once again though and tells my mom that it’s my brother’s choice. My mom is done at this point and says, “you’re right, it’s his choice, we aren’t going to discuss this anymore.”‘and Satan comes back with, “you’re right, we’re not….it’s insane that I’m even getting this phone call right now.” My mom says, “you know what I didn’t even expect it to get like this….” Satan still talking, “you called me….you tell me….” my mom cuts her off, “I asked you if you can find it in your heart and you started arguing with me.” Satan asks her, “what am I trying to find in my heart? To make him do something? I can’t make him do something”. I mean she really doesn’t know? She doesn’t get it because she is a sociopath. This conversation confirmed it for me. My brother’s wife is a narcopath! She controls EVERYTHING he does and in my up coming posts, you will see just how serious I am about it.
Suddenly my brother’s voice can be heard in the background. I guess he wasn’t really at the gym. He’s asking her what’s going on and she starts to explain that my mom called her up and started to fight with her. (Lies). My mom says to her, “the anger behind it shows that you don’t even want it to happen and that’s fine….this is what I needed to know and I know it now.” Satan comes back laughing and says, “I don’t even know what you’re talking about at this point and to be honest, I don’t even care, because you’re calling me up with this ridiculous stuff because you only want to hear what you want to hear. Your putting everything on me and [my brother], really you really need to go put something on [me].” She goes on to say that I am part of the problem the. She says, “you just said to me, [me] would say hi to him in a heartbeat, but you told me you told her to say hi to him and she doesn’t, you see you’re only contradicting yourself….”. My mom explains again, “[me] doesn’t want to be slapped down again by [my brother], he did it several times….he slapped her down several times….”. We never knew if Satan ever found out that my brother came to my house that day but if she didn’t know, she was about to find out because my mom explained, “he came to her house one day, I don’t know if he ever told you about it but since you read the letters [me] wrote then you know that he came to her house one day, said he wanted to make up and did but he wanted to keep it a secret from you, and then [me] never heard from him again so she doesn’t want to do it unless he’s willing.” There was a deafening silence from Satan… she then turns to my brother and says, “your mom is saying you went to her house and wanted to keep it a secret from me…..” after a long pause you hear my brother say., “well…….yeah.”. Satan says, “well I’m just telling you what your mother is telling me.” She gets back on the phone with my mom and says, “well I’m gonna go, I was just in the middle of powerwashing my windows!”. My mom says, “go ahead, go powerwash your windows.” You hear Satan go, “I am and I am telling you….” but my mom hung up the phone.
His secret was out. We assumed she knew about that by now but clearly she didn’t. I can only imagine the lashing my brother got after my mom hung up on her. I’m surprised he was able to talk his way out of that one. She was clearly pissed. My mom got her answer and from that day forward, she started the process of acceptance…..
To be continued in my next post….